Thanks, Michael. There is a different aspect to this story that I believe needs to be mentioned. The simple recipe for bringing down powerful nations and empires is to enrage them. When Gavrilo Princip shot crown prince Franz Ferdinand in 1914, the Austrian empire had hundreds of options for dealing with the problem. Unfortunately, they chose war, and the rest is history. Likewise, 9/11 was a horrible terrorist attack, but the main damage it did to the USA was self-inflicted. Israel now seems to be repeating the mistakes of previous empires. Nobody is denying Israel's right to defend itself, but unfortunately it failed to do so October 7th. Nobody denies Israel the right to punish the perpetrators of the horrific terrorist attack. However, killing innocent civilians as an act of revenge is madness.
“An eye for an eye will leave the whole world blind.”
I don’t understand the USA being damaged by 9/11 as “self-inflicted”. Totally at a loss over this comment. I worked in the 2WTC and have no idea what you’re talking about.
Henrick is speaking to our disgraceful response. Somehow, Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice convinced our gullible citizens and Tony Blair that the thing to do was make war on an innocent nation, Iraq. Brown University estimated at least 308,000 lives were needlessly lost because of our war-like culture. But this is all for another discussion. Now,. back to Israel and Palestine.
an innocent nation?? Saddam was a sadistic killer sitting on the worlds second largest oil supply rather than be a good trading partner he was a sadistic murderer who gassed people and was setting up labs for WMD. Pre emptive strike was so good. Read in Newsweek he like to take Viagra while he watched people's eyes being gouged out. Steve you are twisted. They are still an enemy now even after they were liberated
Terrorist attacks are always carried out to provoke an irrational response by the powerful. Gavrilo Princip fired one bullet and took down four empires, which is a decent return on investment. Likewise, the purpose of 9/11 was to provoke the US into shooting itself in the foot and the US government swallowed the bait. How can it be smart to do exactly what the terrorists want you to do?
I don't know WWI ourstory - why it happened when you say the Austrians had hundreds of other options. Maybe name a couple.
I do know about 9/11/2001, and you say "but the main damage it did to the USA was self-inflicted." Again - you don't explain what you mean by that.
Without going into how and why Israel was even created, and all the wrongs that occurred in the process, and since then, you say "Nobody is denying Israel's right to defend itself, but unfortunately it failed to do so October 7th." Actually, a bunch of countries and peoples are openly calling for the genocide against Jews, and the end to Israel. I guess you don't hear them or read about them.
You are right that the Israelis really blew their border security in the time leading up to OCT 7, 2023. It makes no sense to me how they let that happen. Unfortunately, Hamas and Hezbollah are like mold that is growing on our food. We can cut that bad part out, or throw out the whole dish. It's a shame the good has to suffer for the bad, but what is the choice?
Thank you for speaking out...the oppressed became the oppressors. Being anti-Zionist is not anti-Semitic. Israelis do not have a right to Palestinians lands and their property. Yet we have stood silently on the sidelines for no less than 7 decades while Israel continued to overrun and expand beyond what was given to them in 1948. That gift was at the hands of Great Britain and the US who wanted to break up the last of the Ottoman Empire and they found Zionism to be a very convenient friend. Every action has a reaction. We’ve allowed Israel to marginalize and violently expel Palestinians from their homes with no retribution from the U.S. since 1967. We’re been supporting an apartheid state and now we’re supporting genocide. Where is our humanity?
But the Palestinians are not the indigenous blood of these territories. The Israelis are not either. So why would you choose one invading group over another? Why with no understanding of a thousands of years long conflict would you choose a side? And if you did... I dare you, choose to wake up tomorrow a Palestinian woman or an Israeli woman. Genocide has been raging throughout the Middle East for thousands of years. And I doubt you've even heard of the most persecuted group, who is richest in the most indigenous blood. Yet you pick sides?
No race or civilization is a. Indigenous blood of any part of this planet or any planet. We are all part of a living universe/multiverse with a purpose to add positive, creative bliss to the ethereal source energy. A massive change is imminent.
Drew, that's good and necessary answer. People moved about this earth as long as people existed and to entitle any of them to any part of it due to their ancestry makes no sense. Nor does the proposition that the god of one group gave them a specific part of the earth and thus, their rights to that part of the earth supersede rights of all people, even those who do not subscribe to that particular god or any god at all.
So, you then you do support conquerors invading and committing genocide? Because that's what your statement means. Indigenous Americans, Africans and others included. You just claimed no one is indigenous and has a right to any part of this planet. That literally means no one has a right to live anywhere and be kept alive. You're ignoring the reality that the world has a violent and bloody history of peaceful agriculturally focused groups being slaughtered by invading nomadic murderous pillagers, who destroy farm lands and keep going, during every major to minor period of climate change.
When a group of people have lived in the same place under their same ancestors' artifacts with proof of at least 30k years, peacefully, and in harmony with nature, they focus on developing civilization, agriculture, education, the arts, health, cerebrating life, and spirituality. This ends when desperate uncivilized invaders commit genocide. It works because settled indigenous peoples don't focus on training for war. They trade with their neighbors. The excuse of the slaughtering invaders is always what you just stated, "No one has a right to this land, to their ancient farms, to their children's well-being... If we can move in and murder and steal, survival of the fittest... then we have the right to do as we please, because we can."
Nice argument.
But some humans have evolved beyond the cave man mentality... And that's the real issue, some have not.
There is right and wrong.
Claiming no one has a right to continue to live peacefully and in harmony with nature, focused on good things not war, where their ancestors have developed civilization since the beginning of humanity... Is wrong.
Zionism is the ideology that's the basis of all evil that some humans do to other humans that happen to be different from each other.
It matters not, the variations between those humans, it's all based on the defining ideology of zionism. Nazism, fascism, communism all for sure ,but even our precious capitalism uses the rabid nationalism, the fear mongering, the fabricateddevisive distractions that drive the tiny wedges into the exploited fractures that expand them into the canyons of conflicts that the zionist media outlets that point out and expand the faulty system we all seem to rely on to support our cognitive dissonance.
In US we, as serf class wage slaves, have been "managed" like a herd of sheeple to be raised to work to support the international Central Banking System that our nation ,in 1945, was assigned the sweet, profitable duty of muscle, after the UK lost it's ability to further facilitate the complete treasure harvestation of every Serf class wage slave on Earth.
As for Theodor Hertzl's dream...let's not further that crapola anylonger.
Hamas is well funded and they could have built hospitals, schools, water works, housing but instead they bought weapons, land mines, rockets, missiles, instead of making peoples lives better, they slaughter them, much like the nazis.
It's a bunch of barbaric monsters who kill their own people when convenient, throw gay people off of roofs and call for the killing of all Jews in the world. Is that a political party?
Yet the licud party has been exterminating the Semitic tribe of palestinians since 1945...are you not aware? Cognitive dissonance is in you...try harder to ignore uncomfortable truths.
Zionism created nazism and now zionism has created a small rabid nationalist licud party.
Zionists killing a Semitic tribe...what a cruel reversal of history
"A bunch of barbaric monsters who kill their own people when convenient". Sounds like what Netanyahu is complicit to as well. You don't need to choose sides, Alison. Sometimes you need to take a step back and use your critical thinking skills.
But they will not call themselves, Semitic. Because they do not believe they are equal to any Jew, but better than any Jew. And just like our own clown martyr, they perceive themselves as martyrs, everyone and everything is against them!!! Whaaa whaaa whaaa!!!
Oh he'll yes I do...you think it's Theodor Hertzl's dream of a greater Israel...that was settled in 1948...but I'm talking about the current "ideology" of zionism...the foundation of fascism, nazism, communism and capitalism. Greed, rabid nationalism, divisive distraction by living to the Serf class(you) repeatedly till you will do anything for "da murder land".
Licud partynis the nazi party of Israel and half of all jews know it. You just still dreaming.
Go search for" Theodor Hertzl, Greater Israel map"
Now claim you've been semantically persecuted while Israeli IDF murders another Semitic tribe of Palastinians.
You are a brainwashed pitiful sheeple. I'm a well informed earthling
Please do not group us all together for your own convenient narrative and you do not speak for all of us. Many of us are not with blinders on and we know Natanyahu is filth with blood on his hands, dripping endlessly at the tip of each finger.
I think you forget how the war started in 1967!!!! The British drew the map for a home for Jews during WW1. But they never acted or stood behind the Jews for 30+ years, always taking the side of the Palestinian. Finally after WW11, the Jews took it upon themselves to make a country laid out by the UK. The Arabs have never accepted Jews or Israel and they never will!
I remember when Israel gave Gaza back to the Arabs. They left homes, fields, green houses too many to count, why did the Palestinian not use them but instead destroyed all the assets? Because they were built by Jews!!! How insane is that? But it goes to the mindset of the Palestinian/Arabs.
Palestinians are Semites just like the Jews. Palestinians are not Arabs. That’s why the Arabs: Egyptians etc are sitting back watching the show of the Semites destroy themselves. Heartbreaking.
Why in the world would you say that Palestinians are not Arabs? Just because other Arabs oppose them? When Iraq invaded Kuwait, did that mean that Kuwaitis were not Arabs?
"Semite" does not mean a resident of the area of Israel/Palestine. Arabs and Jews are Semites. The term antisemitism is a Victorian euphemism for hatred of Jews. There are many who want the term replaced by "Jew hatred." We don't have a word for hatred of Blacks or Asians or even Muslims, why not abolish the use of "antisemitic" as a single word.
Egypt Sadaat’s widow in an interview said P. are not Arabs and we don’t want them in Egypt. Today Egypt is not allowing them to emigrate to Egypt. Other Arab leaders have said the same. Arabs view P. as ethnically the same as the Jews. I don’t understand it.
Yes, very weird. Yasser Arafat's ancestry was mostly Egyptian. I understand that for political reasons most Arab countries want nothing to do with Palestinians except as immigrant labor, no different from, say, Filipinos. Maybe it's therefore necessary to deny their Arabhood.
If you are referring to the Balfour Declaration, you should recall that it specified a secular state with equal rights for Jews and Muslims, a provision that was immediately rejected by the Zionists. It is thus ingenious to cite the British map drawing exercise as precedence for any Israeli claims. Moreover, like the Sykes-Picot Agreement there was no affirmation of the inhabitants for the outsiders' decision.
We are still suffering for the thoughtless, arrogant and vindictive decisions of the victors of WW1. If ever there were to be a blueprint for what not to do, that's it.
Lies. Gaza should look likeDubai now but for the withholding of any funds from obscene rich oil nations who sadistically withheld helping them. There were no Jews left in Gaza after 1967 and they did nothing but vote in hamas who abuse them to this day and they deserve it They are all evil haters
Being anti-Zionist is indeed antisemitic. It's actually Jew hatred. Since Jerusalem is in our holy book hundreds of times you cannot separate one from the other. Plus the Hamas charter calls not just to kill all Israelis but all Jews. We are indigenous to Israel the Arabs are not. They are indigenous to Saudi Arabia and are colonizers in every other place they are found.
Think you need to research the history of Gaza as you are patently incorrect in your recitation of history. Wiki it and you can read 4000 years of turmoil
I suspect Netanyahu KNEW but decided not to respond because he saw a chance maybe to put a stop to the masses of objections to his policies? I think also that this is a geopolitical war between Russia China Iran and the USA, being enacted in Ukraine and now in The Gaza Strip!
There is zero will to find the correct solution viz the Palestinians. We’re only here because the Brits made absolutely sure the path forward for the two tribes in that area was going to be bloody. The Brits did the same in India. Once the writing on the wall was obvious, the retreat by the Brits made damned sure peace was not obtainable.
I’m a staunch pacifist. These days for every child killed in any “war” hundreds of terrorists will be the result.
There’s no sides here but one: humanity.
HATE
it has caused a lot of problems in this world, but it has not solved one yet.
This is exactly what I thought. Netanyahu is punishing the dissenting voters. Exactly what Trump has planned for the USA, and what Putin has also done. They are all being rewarded by the weapons/arms MIC protection rackets.
I’ve read a lot of WWII & Churchill biographies. The Jews were considered a problem much like African Americans. The Brits - not all of course- wanted them out of Europe. And knowing there would be conflicts would always allow the Brits back in. BP stands for British petroleum. Watch Lawrence of Arabia. The whole area is a British concept not very well conceived - on purpose.
Michael. Thank you for that article and the time you took to pen these words. To make things more obvious for some people who see one thing and infer another, your words were not in favor of any one party but in favor of non-violence in general. You provided reasons for Israel not to go on a revenge campaign but rather to simply defend itself. Unfortunately, the warmongers in this world, as you so rightly pointed out, are never satisfied with that ideology. We are fast moving towards a sorry end, as human race I meant. God help us all.
Mass media owned by right wing billionaires guarantees we will not have a source for just straight forward information. I can’t do anything about mass media, but I can research on my own
You seem to “lump” “ALL PALESTINIANS” with HAMAS. The Israelis are NOT trying to exterminate the Palestinians off the earth. Hamas has relentlessly tried to do this to the Israelis and the Israelis are targeting HAMAS. Hamas use humans (their own, and now their more than 150 hostages) as human shields. Hamas uses hospitals and schools as places where they hide their weapons and themselves. Hamas BEGAN THIS TRAGEDY by swooping in on gliders and busting through fences,indiscriminately killing any and ALL JEWS they could find. They even plucked them off in porta-potties at the music festival. They tossed grenades in shelters where innocent people were hiding for cover. THEY INDISCRIMINATELY KILLED JEWS, NO MATTER HOW YOUNG, OLD, PREGNANT, OR DISABLED THEY MAY BE. The ISRAELIS ARE INDEED holding of their attack, allowing the innocent Palestinians to retreat. Israelis MUST and SHALL thread this needle carefully. UNLIKE HAMAS, THEY VALUE LIFE, - THEIR OWN, and THOSE OF INNOCENT PEOPLE. However, it’s time to rid Hamas completely. Hamas began this attack, yet again. If they murdered your family so brutally Michael, would you be so forgiving? Hamas ARE NOT ALL PALESTINIANS any more than HEZBOLLAH are ALL LEBANESE.
Thank you for bucking the tide here. Michael's piece is an insult and he is doing just what Hamas wants: calling for a cease fire while they run back to hide behind civilians . The war is with Hamas, not Palestinians. If Israel wanted genocide, there would be no warnings or chance to evacuate, just carpet bombing. Hamas hides behind these civilians and cannot be treated at freedom fighters; they have also kept Gazans under their dictatorial rule since 2005. The tragedy here is that starting with Arafat, these terrorist groups discovered how their attacks work to FRACTURE the western world's liberals by casting Israel as the uniformed armed oppressor and the violent militants as the oppressed.
Of course Bibi and his cohorts have only enflamed the situation with punishing policy but what Western Minds don't get is that before you can have meaningful peace you need to eliminate these kinds of terrorists. You don't negotiate with a Hamas whose charter is the elimination of Israel outright.
You and many others refuse to see the actual facts, Israel has made Palestine the largest open air prison in the world, all Palestinians are prisoners, when Israel says we are giving the Palestinians warnings to go somewhere else before they bomb their homes, just where do you think Palestinians are going to go? Israel is not bombing just Humus, they are wiping out entire Palestinian families, families who had nothing to do with the attack on Israel. There is no justification to kill innocent Israelis either. The thing is you and others are ignoring the crimes Israel was committing against the Palestinians for decades, Making their country a prison, Israel wipes out entire Palestinian settlements, Israeli snipers kill thousands of Palestinian men, women, and children each year, Palestinians only get 4 hours of electricity per day, very little food, almost no medical care. So now people like you just ignore the facts so you can justify your own bias point of view.
Lies saw photos today of Gaza tree lined boulevards not bad housing overweight women fed well they are losers no one wants them Gaza should look like Dubai at this point but the oil sheiks withheld funding them deliberately go blame them you loser
You and many others refuse to see the actual facts, Israel has made Palestine the largest open air prison in the world, all Palestinians are prisoners, when Israel says we are giving the Palestinians warnings to go somewhere else before they bomb their homes, just where do you think Palestinians are going to go? Israel is not bombing just Humus, they are wiping out entire Palestinian families, families who had nothing to do with the attack on Israel. There is no justification to kill innocent Israelis either. The thing is you and others are ignoring the crimes Israel was committing against the Palestinians for decades, Making their country a prison, Israel wipes out entire Palestinian settlements, Israeli snipers kill thousands of Palestinian men, women, and children each year, Palestinians only get 4 hours of electricity per day, very little food, almost no medical care. So now people like you just ignore the facts so you can justify your own bias and prejudice point of view.
Israel has the best intelligence in the world. the videos they have zoom in close ups. I find it very hard to believe that the Israelis can’t find and arrest the bad actors. Actually impossible to believe. They’re hiding? Where are the hiding? In a ghetto monitored by the Israelites. And the Israelis can’t find them? Do you believe that? Really?
The network of subterranean tunnels Hamas has built over time is why even Israeli intel is limited in finding them. I predict that as Israel infiltrates over the coming weeks that even they will be surprised at much has been hidden below ground
yep this is what hamas did with any funding that came their way yet palest voted them just like they kept that thief Arafat around for thirty years these people are hateful losers!
All the same I myself find it hard to believe that thousands of hamas militants were involved in the Oct 7 raids and massacres and no one in Israel had a clue. And many Israeli civilians want an answer to that one as well.
No, of course he would not "play" into anyone's hands intentionally. Please read my thread I posted on his page today. In short it summarizes that Arafat and later Hamas discovered the game of playing the West through the media. Stage a terrorist attack, make sure it provokes Israel to a response, then cast Israel as the armed uniformed oppressor assaulting plain clothes civilians. Which gets non Jewish Western liberal sympathy for the very people who initiated the attack. And yes, Palestinian civilians are caught in the middle. Similar thing with sending missiles into Israel from a civilian location (school, hospital) and then when Israel counterstrikes, they gladly display the civilian casualties as Israeli intended genocide. This doesn't make Israel without any blame in these casualties, but do recognize that it's engineered by Hamas who anticipates the "west's" reaction.
So unfortunately, Western non Jewish liberals predicable response to terror attacks actually helps give incentive for more, which gets Israel retaliating, etc....
The pitfall here is that we are inclined to view Hamas’ actions with a Western mindset - but terrorist subculture in the Mideast can fool us. Our logic is that such groups and extremism can only form when conditions become so unfair and brutal that this is an inevitable result and therefore the “oppressors” are ultimately to blame ( not the terrorist actors). That is only half true- for in our own country we see today extremist supremicist groups acting out in scenarios like the January 6 insurrection. Was it true that Dems stole the election and that white culture is so persecuted that Oath Keepers and Proud Boys were justified? Of course not.
Palestinian civilians have suffered at the hands of both Israeli policy and Hamas - who have ensured that Gaza became a prison by using aid money to only attack Israel and force a wider conflict which they exploit. Then throw in that Hamas is sponsored and supported by foreign actors like Iran who have their own Stake in keeping the conflict going.
So while Israeli policy must improve for sure , that alone will not dismantle such a terrorist group and their stranglehold over Gaza.
Yes exactly. Concerning 9/11, I would like to know why Saudi Arabia was not called on for reparations for all the victims. Since the largest portion of that group were Saudis!
Bingo! If Gaza and issues surrounding her didn’t exist, I still believe Hamas would have attacked because the bottom line is they want all Jews dead. Good bye Michael Moore. I’m done subscribing.
Taking sides at this point in the world's madness just illustrates the level of insanity now being reached. A massive shift to sensibility is imminent.
And yet over 1500 Palestinian children lay dead, 47 entire Palestinian families taken off the register in Gaza. All dead from Israeli bombs supplied in part by the U.S.
Their deaths are on Netanyahu’s hands, and on Biden’s hands. Man’s inhumanity to Man. How terribly, awfully tragic all of this is.
And if this goes unchecked in Israel and Gaza, it opens the doors to happen unchecked everywhere. And THAT is terrifying!
Israel does not want to kill all Palestinians as you say. It means to evacuate them. Just a bit more to go and then success. Andrew Jackson evacuated the Cherokee nation, but that was another time. Rounding up Palestinians and marching them on a trail of tears wouldn't be tolerated as it was when the Cherokee were marched to Oklahoma. Now it apparently takes a war and a warning to the Palestinians to evacuate what little is left of Palestine or get blown up by warplanes, bombs and tanks. Same motives with updated means. Andy Jackson could have done the same except he didn't have warplanes or tanks.
I watched how the British/Aussies murdered the aboriginals by surprise attacking villages in pre dawn "attacks" and driving them off cliffs and decapitating civilians including women and paying soldiers bounties for doing it then calling the actions a war. This was within the last 150 yrs. How can anyone excuse this type of behaviour in 2023? The military contractors are taking their turn on the greed wheel of fortune. Big pharma did it with covid. Tech did it with crypto and now AI. Big oil is always hogging the greed wheel of fortune. Big banks/ finance are now trying to take the wheel back with interest hikes. The money pigs will be stopped. Mass shift is imminent.
While I agree with the point that Hamas started this, and they do not represent all of the Palestinians in Gaza, Israel is carrying out collective punishment by stopping the flow of water, food, fuel and power to the Strip. It is also killing civilians and destroying homes. These are war crimes, under the Geneva Conventions.
The sheer scale of the assault, coupled with the fact that all 10 crossings in or out of Gaza are closed (9 controlled directly by Israel, the 10th held by Egypt has been damaged by bombing and remains under threat of further attack by Israel), means that the population of 2.3 million people is extremely vulnerable and fast running out of very basic necessities for life. This in a place where 47% of the population are children.
What Hamas did was, and still is, wrong. I don’t understand how this response from Israel is going to return any hostages alive, when they are as likely to be injured or killed in the bombing as their captors are. I also don’t understand how this collective punishment is supposed to deter Hamas (or Hezbollah) in future, as surely it is just traumatising more young people, leading to the next generation in the cycle of hate.
Zionists "started" this by killing palestinians and driving them from their property. Did you know that any palestinians can't sell their property to other palestinians?
Are you aware that if any palestinians commit ANY crime (a teen throwing a rock at an idf conscript) they go to the home, remove the occupants and bulldoze the buildings, cut down the olive groves and seize the property?
I saw Prime Minister Berscoloni in Charlie Rose years ago. PMB said the Palestinians have been camping out for 3 generations- the interview was approximately 20 years ago. Saying Palestinians started it is like saying Africa Americans started it. No justice. No peace.
Nobody is taking into account the MUCH bigger picture of Islam - the book has clear ends in mind - that of removing any & all humans that do not follow it's demands & succumb to it's authority - these terrorists are followers of THAT Islam - they believe ALL non -Muslims are to be exterminated in the name of their God. No matter how much pandering & 'partnering' to allow for peace happens, that end result is what they are aiming for, and peace is not part of the equation at all. Hence even as ordinary, peaceful Muslims go about their little lives that hell-bent 'Godly' ambition is driving what the extremists do. So - never be surprised at what pops up next as their psychological status demands we never trust them since 'the book' tells them everything is 'ok' as long as it furthers the ultimate purpose ! It's dangerous stuff, and the West does not realize just how dangerous they are ! I'm not sure about there being an actual 'satan' persona, but it certainly looks like the concept has legs to me !
All religions and dogmatic beliefs state this type of monopolistic worthiness doctrine, which only purpose is to divide humanity and continue to play into the fear mongers plan.
The basic message of all religions is do unto others as you would have them do unto you. The other big message is we all have the power of determining our own existence by avoiding falling into the brainwash trap of fear and negativity. The real source information energy is accessible and if humanity can break the brainwash cycle long enough to tap into their fractal connection they'd realize the purpose of existence. These messages were clear in the unedited versions of most recorded or scripted versions of man's origin. These facts were redacted by corrupt religious and political criminal elites who saw the need to control dominate and enslave humanity for individual personal egotistical gain.
Well, someone had to go there. Unfortunately, there are good hearted people in every group. Remember The Women's March, where Israeli Jewish women and Palestinian Muslim women marched together for peace.
But as you've pointed out, the leadership throughout Islam, never condemns extremism... So how is that not condoning it? Mohammed's message was intended during war times... not to be creating endless wars to have relevance. Yet the misinterpretations are worshipped by the leadership of Muslim extremists.
The Jews have often been the only allies to the Middle Eastern Christians, who are the richest in indigenous blood, the most persecuted and devoutly teach, "though shalt not kill"... Yet the West ignores their existence, even as they go extinct.
The world is not educated enough to pick sides in this thousands of year old conflict. Yet if one had to choose to wake up tomorrow a woman or girl in either Palestine or Israel...
The world is not educated enough is so true. I fear mankind as a species is not capable of the level of education you call for. It's at most an ideal to hope and strive for.
Moore needs to get his arse over to Gaza they will exterminate him readily He's a Christian infidel and they are coming for the what they refer to as The Sunday people He is blind to this for some reason
Michael shared more of the history that led to this hideously bloody conflict--click on links. The more we learn, we see the world as less black and white. Unless people learn what really happened in 1948, and then '67, and '73, and so on....
One example here, are you aware of Bibi's attempt to strengthen Hamas in order to weaken the Palestinian Authority? As a result, Hamas felt deeper distrust of Israel, and the PA lost more power to govern and help the Palestinian people. All of this was for Bibi to strengthen his position. Did you follow the links on those who were complicit in Rabin's assassination? (now in power). No one is excusing Hamas, or suggesting equivalency of Hamas and Israel.
His implication that Palestinians never hurt any Jews is ludicrous, too. He must have forgotten that Hamas is Palestinian--and the Palestinians elected Hamas.
Michael, I am about to say something I do not want to say. The truth is that I agree with the intention that no further innocents should die. II am an American non-Jew who lived in Israel for almost 3 years after the Six-Day War. I love Israel, like it is a part of me-- much as I love the United States. I am also a long-time student of Sufism (for those who are unfamiliar with the term, it is-- very roughly speaking-- the mystical side of Islam). What you say about the Palestinians not having been responsible for Auschwitz is true. But neither were the Russians who instigated pogroms against the Jews responsible for Auschwitz; neither were the French whose Vichy regime allied with the Nazis. Neither were the Spanish who evicted the Jews from Spain along with the Muslims. Neither were American white supremacists responsible for Auschwitz, though there is now evidence that the Germans learned from jim crow. The list is long and longer than this of peoples who were not responsible for Auschwitz, yet persecuted the Jews because they were Jews. In addition to this, there is the Hamas Charter. Though it has been amended to suggest a softening of opposition to Israel, here is an excerpt from Wikipedia:
"The original Charter identified Hamas as the Muslim Brotherhood in Palestine and declares its members to be Muslims who "fear God and raise the banner of Jihad in the face of the oppressors." The charter states that "our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious" and calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic state in Palestine, in place of Israel and the Palestinian Territories,[3] and the obliteration or dissolution of Israel.[4][5] It emphasizes the importance of jihad, stating in article 13, "There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."[6] The charter also states that Hamas is humanistic, and tolerant of other religions as long as they "stop disputing the sovereignty of Islam in this region".[7] The Charter adds that "renouncing any part of Palestine means renouncing part of the religion [of Islam]".[1]
This is what the Palestinians who founded Hamas sought. We in the West tend to soften the harshness of these goals too, asserting that what Palestinians “really want” is “self-determination” a vague notion that manages to finesse their real goal of liberation. It is true that most Palestinians want only to live in peace. That’s also true of most Israelis-- most people everwhere want to live in peace. But as it is sometimes remarked that Israelis just wish the Palestinians would disappear as a problem, the same is true for the Palestinians. Even those not committed to violence like to think of a day when Israel is no more, disappeared back into the mists of time. Israelis would experience relief if the Palestinians were no longer there and Palestinians would feel the same way if Israel were no longer there.
So, what is my point? That so long as the Israelis and the Palestinians regard one another’s existence as a threat to their own, nothing will change. That peace-- real peace-- requires some real willingness to give up the quest for one’s own survival at all costs. That real peace requires a willingness to acknowledge each other’s suffering and say, in effect, “We do not want you to suffer any more and we will stand by you as brothers. We want you to have a state and independence and we want to be your brother state: we will defend you and you will defend us. There will no longer be one justice for me and a different justice for you.”
And the problem is that neither is willing to do this, trust the other. Because each side knows the other just wants it to disappear. To do this would require a deep spiritual revival among both Israelis and Palestinians, Jews and Muslims. In their respective spiritual traditions and teachings there is common ground and spiritual brotherhood to be found for those willing to seek these. But we are not in times that people feel inspired to seek spiritual guidance. Unless those who suffer are willing to seek spiritual ground with those they deem responsible for their suffering and the suffering of their loved ones, the best that one who loves both sides who live in this “holy land” can do, is advocate for Justice to be implented even against one’s self and one’s family. That justice is also called Compassion. I am 75 years old now and have become convinced that in this life in this world, the only possible way to receive it is to first be willing to extend it. I pray to God that He soften hearts enough that they be willing to risk themselves for this possibility.
Thanks, Michael. There is a different aspect to this story that I believe needs to be mentioned. The simple recipe for bringing down powerful nations and empires is to enrage them. When Gavrilo Princip shot crown prince Franz Ferdinand in 1914, the Austrian empire had hundreds of options for dealing with the problem. Unfortunately, they chose war, and the rest is history. Likewise, 9/11 was a horrible terrorist attack, but the main damage it did to the USA was self-inflicted. Israel now seems to be repeating the mistakes of previous empires. Nobody is denying Israel's right to defend itself, but unfortunately it failed to do so October 7th. Nobody denies Israel the right to punish the perpetrators of the horrific terrorist attack. However, killing innocent civilians as an act of revenge is madness.
“An eye for an eye will leave the whole world blind.”
I don’t understand the USA being damaged by 9/11 as “self-inflicted”. Totally at a loss over this comment. I worked in the 2WTC and have no idea what you’re talking about.
Henrick is speaking to our disgraceful response. Somehow, Bush/Cheney/Rumsfeld/Rice convinced our gullible citizens and Tony Blair that the thing to do was make war on an innocent nation, Iraq. Brown University estimated at least 308,000 lives were needlessly lost because of our war-like culture. But this is all for another discussion. Now,. back to Israel and Palestine.
Don't forget the Patriot Act.
an innocent nation?? Saddam was a sadistic killer sitting on the worlds second largest oil supply rather than be a good trading partner he was a sadistic murderer who gassed people and was setting up labs for WMD. Pre emptive strike was so good. Read in Newsweek he like to take Viagra while he watched people's eyes being gouged out. Steve you are twisted. They are still an enemy now even after they were liberated
Innocent of attacking America on 9/11. That is the subject of the side conversation.
Seems like the key term is "rather than be a good trading partner."
If the US is so concerned with punishing leaders it doesn't approve of, why doesn't it attack North Korea?
What’s with the comment 9/11 was self inflicted????
Terrorist attacks are always carried out to provoke an irrational response by the powerful. Gavrilo Princip fired one bullet and took down four empires, which is a decent return on investment. Likewise, the purpose of 9/11 was to provoke the US into shooting itself in the foot and the US government swallowed the bait. How can it be smart to do exactly what the terrorists want you to do?
Henrik Nordborg -
I don't know WWI ourstory - why it happened when you say the Austrians had hundreds of other options. Maybe name a couple.
I do know about 9/11/2001, and you say "but the main damage it did to the USA was self-inflicted." Again - you don't explain what you mean by that.
Without going into how and why Israel was even created, and all the wrongs that occurred in the process, and since then, you say "Nobody is denying Israel's right to defend itself, but unfortunately it failed to do so October 7th." Actually, a bunch of countries and peoples are openly calling for the genocide against Jews, and the end to Israel. I guess you don't hear them or read about them.
You are right that the Israelis really blew their border security in the time leading up to OCT 7, 2023. It makes no sense to me how they let that happen. Unfortunately, Hamas and Hezbollah are like mold that is growing on our food. We can cut that bad part out, or throw out the whole dish. It's a shame the good has to suffer for the bad, but what is the choice?
And since Hamas embeds within Palestinian society, we shouldn't retaliate? This has been going on since we left Gaza. Time to finish it.
Thank you for speaking out...the oppressed became the oppressors. Being anti-Zionist is not anti-Semitic. Israelis do not have a right to Palestinians lands and their property. Yet we have stood silently on the sidelines for no less than 7 decades while Israel continued to overrun and expand beyond what was given to them in 1948. That gift was at the hands of Great Britain and the US who wanted to break up the last of the Ottoman Empire and they found Zionism to be a very convenient friend. Every action has a reaction. We’ve allowed Israel to marginalize and violently expel Palestinians from their homes with no retribution from the U.S. since 1967. We’re been supporting an apartheid state and now we’re supporting genocide. Where is our humanity?
But the Palestinians are not the indigenous blood of these territories. The Israelis are not either. So why would you choose one invading group over another? Why with no understanding of a thousands of years long conflict would you choose a side? And if you did... I dare you, choose to wake up tomorrow a Palestinian woman or an Israeli woman. Genocide has been raging throughout the Middle East for thousands of years. And I doubt you've even heard of the most persecuted group, who is richest in the most indigenous blood. Yet you pick sides?
No race or civilization is a. Indigenous blood of any part of this planet or any planet. We are all part of a living universe/multiverse with a purpose to add positive, creative bliss to the ethereal source energy. A massive change is imminent.
Drew, that's good and necessary answer. People moved about this earth as long as people existed and to entitle any of them to any part of it due to their ancestry makes no sense. Nor does the proposition that the god of one group gave them a specific part of the earth and thus, their rights to that part of the earth supersede rights of all people, even those who do not subscribe to that particular god or any god at all.
You write from the top of the mountain while most are in the marketplace. Still, from a place of love, which goes to all not some.
https://www.iwgia.org/en/palestine/5142-iw-2023-palestine.html
- the IWGIA’s report on Palestine of how the indigenous tribes have been and are being treated by the Israeli govt
What's the historic limit to claims of land ownership on planet earth ? No beings on this planet have a right to own any part of it.
So, you then you do support conquerors invading and committing genocide? Because that's what your statement means. Indigenous Americans, Africans and others included. You just claimed no one is indigenous and has a right to any part of this planet. That literally means no one has a right to live anywhere and be kept alive. You're ignoring the reality that the world has a violent and bloody history of peaceful agriculturally focused groups being slaughtered by invading nomadic murderous pillagers, who destroy farm lands and keep going, during every major to minor period of climate change.
When a group of people have lived in the same place under their same ancestors' artifacts with proof of at least 30k years, peacefully, and in harmony with nature, they focus on developing civilization, agriculture, education, the arts, health, cerebrating life, and spirituality. This ends when desperate uncivilized invaders commit genocide. It works because settled indigenous peoples don't focus on training for war. They trade with their neighbors. The excuse of the slaughtering invaders is always what you just stated, "No one has a right to this land, to their ancient farms, to their children's well-being... If we can move in and murder and steal, survival of the fittest... then we have the right to do as we please, because we can."
Nice argument.
But some humans have evolved beyond the cave man mentality... And that's the real issue, some have not.
There is right and wrong.
Claiming no one has a right to continue to live peacefully and in harmony with nature, focused on good things not war, where their ancestors have developed civilization since the beginning of humanity... Is wrong.
Zionism is the ideology that's the basis of all evil that some humans do to other humans that happen to be different from each other.
It matters not, the variations between those humans, it's all based on the defining ideology of zionism. Nazism, fascism, communism all for sure ,but even our precious capitalism uses the rabid nationalism, the fear mongering, the fabricateddevisive distractions that drive the tiny wedges into the exploited fractures that expand them into the canyons of conflicts that the zionist media outlets that point out and expand the faulty system we all seem to rely on to support our cognitive dissonance.
In US we, as serf class wage slaves, have been "managed" like a herd of sheeple to be raised to work to support the international Central Banking System that our nation ,in 1945, was assigned the sweet, profitable duty of muscle, after the UK lost it's ability to further facilitate the complete treasure harvestation of every Serf class wage slave on Earth.
As for Theodor Hertzl's dream...let's not further that crapola anylonger.
Hamas is well funded and they could have built hospitals, schools, water works, housing but instead they bought weapons, land mines, rockets, missiles, instead of making peoples lives better, they slaughter them, much like the nazis.
Also nazis were zionists that killed jews..now likud party is Jewish party that kills a Semitic tribe of palestinians
excellent YOU NAILED IT!! Read this comment traitor Moore
Grow up, Beth.
Hamas is a political party...nothing more
It's a bunch of barbaric monsters who kill their own people when convenient, throw gay people off of roofs and call for the killing of all Jews in the world. Is that a political party?
Yet the licud party has been exterminating the Semitic tribe of palestinians since 1945...are you not aware? Cognitive dissonance is in you...try harder to ignore uncomfortable truths.
Zionism created nazism and now zionism has created a small rabid nationalist licud party.
Zionists killing a Semitic tribe...what a cruel reversal of history
"A bunch of barbaric monsters who kill their own people when convenient". Sounds like what Netanyahu is complicit to as well. You don't need to choose sides, Alison. Sometimes you need to take a step back and use your critical thinking skills.
Wow so much antisemitism dripping from your words.
Nothing I said was antisemitism.
I'm antizionist...100%
Just like many Jewish people.
You have no idea what antisemitism is. Palestinians are also a Semitic tribe
But they will not call themselves, Semitic. Because they do not believe they are equal to any Jew, but better than any Jew. And just like our own clown martyr, they perceive themselves as martyrs, everyone and everything is against them!!! Whaaa whaaa whaaa!!!
Wow...when a Muslim dies they become martyrs...not before death. Learn first...speak later.
There is only one race of humanoids on earth...we are all part of it.
Stop allowing yourself to be brainwashed into thinking you are somehow a better human than anyother human.
Zionism does that to you nomatter what you think.
Pick a more compassionate ideology
And you have no idea what Zionism is.
Oh he'll yes I do...you think it's Theodor Hertzl's dream of a greater Israel...that was settled in 1948...but I'm talking about the current "ideology" of zionism...the foundation of fascism, nazism, communism and capitalism. Greed, rabid nationalism, divisive distraction by living to the Serf class(you) repeatedly till you will do anything for "da murder land".
Licud partynis the nazi party of Israel and half of all jews know it. You just still dreaming.
Go search for" Theodor Hertzl, Greater Israel map"
Now claim you've been semantically persecuted while Israeli IDF murders another Semitic tribe of Palastinians.
You are a brainwashed pitiful sheeple. I'm a well informed earthling
Very few Jews have that opinion. How many of us in the world do you think there are anyway?
Please do not group us all together for your own convenient narrative and you do not speak for all of us. Many of us are not with blinders on and we know Natanyahu is filth with blood on his hands, dripping endlessly at the tip of each finger.
There is only one humanoid race on earth...but the cults have claimed they are somehow different.
Zionism is in you. Wear your badge proudly.
No, that's just your inability to read without interpreting it in your own convenient way.
You wolld have fit in nicely with certain people in the 1930s. Too bad you missed your calling.
Actually both are. Recent DNA evidence from Canaanite burial grounds shows that both the Palestinians and Jews world-wide are descended from them.
Yes, we Israelis (Jews) are indigenous to Israel, Judea (what do you think Judea means?) and Samaria.
Who do you think has more indigenous blood than the Israelis?
I think you forget how the war started in 1967!!!! The British drew the map for a home for Jews during WW1. But they never acted or stood behind the Jews for 30+ years, always taking the side of the Palestinian. Finally after WW11, the Jews took it upon themselves to make a country laid out by the UK. The Arabs have never accepted Jews or Israel and they never will!
I remember when Israel gave Gaza back to the Arabs. They left homes, fields, green houses too many to count, why did the Palestinian not use them but instead destroyed all the assets? Because they were built by Jews!!! How insane is that? But it goes to the mindset of the Palestinian/Arabs.
Palestinians are Semites just like the Jews. Palestinians are not Arabs. That’s why the Arabs: Egyptians etc are sitting back watching the show of the Semites destroy themselves. Heartbreaking.
Why in the world would you say that Palestinians are not Arabs? Just because other Arabs oppose them? When Iraq invaded Kuwait, did that mean that Kuwaitis were not Arabs?
"Semite" does not mean a resident of the area of Israel/Palestine. Arabs and Jews are Semites. The term antisemitism is a Victorian euphemism for hatred of Jews. There are many who want the term replaced by "Jew hatred." We don't have a word for hatred of Blacks or Asians or even Muslims, why not abolish the use of "antisemitic" as a single word.
Maybe "Jewphobia," like Islamophobia?
Egypt Sadaat’s widow in an interview said P. are not Arabs and we don’t want them in Egypt. Today Egypt is not allowing them to emigrate to Egypt. Other Arab leaders have said the same. Arabs view P. as ethnically the same as the Jews. I don’t understand it.
Yes, very weird. Yasser Arafat's ancestry was mostly Egyptian. I understand that for political reasons most Arab countries want nothing to do with Palestinians except as immigrant labor, no different from, say, Filipinos. Maybe it's therefore necessary to deny their Arabhood.
If you are referring to the Balfour Declaration, you should recall that it specified a secular state with equal rights for Jews and Muslims, a provision that was immediately rejected by the Zionists. It is thus ingenious to cite the British map drawing exercise as precedence for any Israeli claims. Moreover, like the Sykes-Picot Agreement there was no affirmation of the inhabitants for the outsiders' decision.
We are still suffering for the thoughtless, arrogant and vindictive decisions of the victors of WW1. If ever there were to be a blueprint for what not to do, that's it.
excellent points Nancy! Moore needs to read this he will totter and fall
Lies. Gaza should look likeDubai now but for the withholding of any funds from obscene rich oil nations who sadistically withheld helping them. There were no Jews left in Gaza after 1967 and they did nothing but vote in hamas who abuse them to this day and they deserve it They are all evil haters
You are an evil hater, Beth.
Being anti-Zionist is indeed antisemitic. It's actually Jew hatred. Since Jerusalem is in our holy book hundreds of times you cannot separate one from the other. Plus the Hamas charter calls not just to kill all Israelis but all Jews. We are indigenous to Israel the Arabs are not. They are indigenous to Saudi Arabia and are colonizers in every other place they are found.
You are ridiculous.
Think you need to research the history of Gaza as you are patently incorrect in your recitation of history. Wiki it and you can read 4000 years of turmoil
wikipedia is no longer to be trusted as a valid source of accurate info... according to one of the co-founders
I suspect Netanyahu KNEW but decided not to respond because he saw a chance maybe to put a stop to the masses of objections to his policies? I think also that this is a geopolitical war between Russia China Iran and the USA, being enacted in Ukraine and now in The Gaza Strip!
There is zero will to find the correct solution viz the Palestinians. We’re only here because the Brits made absolutely sure the path forward for the two tribes in that area was going to be bloody. The Brits did the same in India. Once the writing on the wall was obvious, the retreat by the Brits made damned sure peace was not obtainable.
I’m a staunch pacifist. These days for every child killed in any “war” hundreds of terrorists will be the result.
There’s no sides here but one: humanity.
HATE
it has caused a lot of problems in this world, but it has not solved one yet.
- Maya Angelou
This is exactly what I thought. Netanyahu is punishing the dissenting voters. Exactly what Trump has planned for the USA, and what Putin has also done. They are all being rewarded by the weapons/arms MIC protection rackets.
I’ve read a lot of WWII & Churchill biographies. The Jews were considered a problem much like African Americans. The Brits - not all of course- wanted them out of Europe. And knowing there would be conflicts would always allow the Brits back in. BP stands for British petroleum. Watch Lawrence of Arabia. The whole area is a British concept not very well conceived - on purpose.
I cannot believe that this was not known but will we ever know that?
since I could only like your comment once❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️
Michael. Thank you for that article and the time you took to pen these words. To make things more obvious for some people who see one thing and infer another, your words were not in favor of any one party but in favor of non-violence in general. You provided reasons for Israel not to go on a revenge campaign but rather to simply defend itself. Unfortunately, the warmongers in this world, as you so rightly pointed out, are never satisfied with that ideology. We are fast moving towards a sorry end, as human race I meant. God help us all.
Many people who are stuck in 3rd dimensional thinking cannot function beyond a simple two directional action.
Mass media is fanning the flames of division in every possible conflict on the planet.
Mass media owned by right wing billionaires guarantees we will not have a source for just straight forward information. I can’t do anything about mass media, but I can research on my own
Yes,
You seem to “lump” “ALL PALESTINIANS” with HAMAS. The Israelis are NOT trying to exterminate the Palestinians off the earth. Hamas has relentlessly tried to do this to the Israelis and the Israelis are targeting HAMAS. Hamas use humans (their own, and now their more than 150 hostages) as human shields. Hamas uses hospitals and schools as places where they hide their weapons and themselves. Hamas BEGAN THIS TRAGEDY by swooping in on gliders and busting through fences,indiscriminately killing any and ALL JEWS they could find. They even plucked them off in porta-potties at the music festival. They tossed grenades in shelters where innocent people were hiding for cover. THEY INDISCRIMINATELY KILLED JEWS, NO MATTER HOW YOUNG, OLD, PREGNANT, OR DISABLED THEY MAY BE. The ISRAELIS ARE INDEED holding of their attack, allowing the innocent Palestinians to retreat. Israelis MUST and SHALL thread this needle carefully. UNLIKE HAMAS, THEY VALUE LIFE, - THEIR OWN, and THOSE OF INNOCENT PEOPLE. However, it’s time to rid Hamas completely. Hamas began this attack, yet again. If they murdered your family so brutally Michael, would you be so forgiving? Hamas ARE NOT ALL PALESTINIANS any more than HEZBOLLAH are ALL LEBANESE.
Thank you for bucking the tide here. Michael's piece is an insult and he is doing just what Hamas wants: calling for a cease fire while they run back to hide behind civilians . The war is with Hamas, not Palestinians. If Israel wanted genocide, there would be no warnings or chance to evacuate, just carpet bombing. Hamas hides behind these civilians and cannot be treated at freedom fighters; they have also kept Gazans under their dictatorial rule since 2005. The tragedy here is that starting with Arafat, these terrorist groups discovered how their attacks work to FRACTURE the western world's liberals by casting Israel as the uniformed armed oppressor and the violent militants as the oppressed.
Of course Bibi and his cohorts have only enflamed the situation with punishing policy but what Western Minds don't get is that before you can have meaningful peace you need to eliminate these kinds of terrorists. You don't negotiate with a Hamas whose charter is the elimination of Israel outright.
You and many others refuse to see the actual facts, Israel has made Palestine the largest open air prison in the world, all Palestinians are prisoners, when Israel says we are giving the Palestinians warnings to go somewhere else before they bomb their homes, just where do you think Palestinians are going to go? Israel is not bombing just Humus, they are wiping out entire Palestinian families, families who had nothing to do with the attack on Israel. There is no justification to kill innocent Israelis either. The thing is you and others are ignoring the crimes Israel was committing against the Palestinians for decades, Making their country a prison, Israel wipes out entire Palestinian settlements, Israeli snipers kill thousands of Palestinian men, women, and children each year, Palestinians only get 4 hours of electricity per day, very little food, almost no medical care. So now people like you just ignore the facts so you can justify your own bias point of view.
I disagree Michael, it seems to me if the Palestinians want peace they are the ones who need to rid themselves of Hamas.
Lies saw photos today of Gaza tree lined boulevards not bad housing overweight women fed well they are losers no one wants them Gaza should look like Dubai at this point but the oil sheiks withheld funding them deliberately go blame them you loser
You and many others refuse to see the actual facts, Israel has made Palestine the largest open air prison in the world, all Palestinians are prisoners, when Israel says we are giving the Palestinians warnings to go somewhere else before they bomb their homes, just where do you think Palestinians are going to go? Israel is not bombing just Humus, they are wiping out entire Palestinian families, families who had nothing to do with the attack on Israel. There is no justification to kill innocent Israelis either. The thing is you and others are ignoring the crimes Israel was committing against the Palestinians for decades, Making their country a prison, Israel wipes out entire Palestinian settlements, Israeli snipers kill thousands of Palestinian men, women, and children each year, Palestinians only get 4 hours of electricity per day, very little food, almost no medical care. So now people like you just ignore the facts so you can justify your own bias and prejudice point of view.
Israel has the best intelligence in the world. the videos they have zoom in close ups. I find it very hard to believe that the Israelis can’t find and arrest the bad actors. Actually impossible to believe. They’re hiding? Where are the hiding? In a ghetto monitored by the Israelites. And the Israelis can’t find them? Do you believe that? Really?
The network of subterranean tunnels Hamas has built over time is why even Israeli intel is limited in finding them. I predict that as Israel infiltrates over the coming weeks that even they will be surprised at much has been hidden below ground
yep this is what hamas did with any funding that came their way yet palest voted them just like they kept that thief Arafat around for thirty years these people are hateful losers!
Do you really believe the Palestinian people had a choice? There have been no elections since Hamas took over, from what I have read.
All the same I myself find it hard to believe that thousands of hamas militants were involved in the Oct 7 raids and massacres and no one in Israel had a clue. And many Israeli civilians want an answer to that one as well.
I do to, and I don’t think it was thousands of Hamas that infiltrated IDF or committed the atrocities in Israel.
Completely agree Kenneth. Thanks.
No, of course he would not "play" into anyone's hands intentionally. Please read my thread I posted on his page today. In short it summarizes that Arafat and later Hamas discovered the game of playing the West through the media. Stage a terrorist attack, make sure it provokes Israel to a response, then cast Israel as the armed uniformed oppressor assaulting plain clothes civilians. Which gets non Jewish Western liberal sympathy for the very people who initiated the attack. And yes, Palestinian civilians are caught in the middle. Similar thing with sending missiles into Israel from a civilian location (school, hospital) and then when Israel counterstrikes, they gladly display the civilian casualties as Israeli intended genocide. This doesn't make Israel without any blame in these casualties, but do recognize that it's engineered by Hamas who anticipates the "west's" reaction.
So unfortunately, Western non Jewish liberals predicable response to terror attacks actually helps give incentive for more, which gets Israel retaliating, etc....
The pitfall here is that we are inclined to view Hamas’ actions with a Western mindset - but terrorist subculture in the Mideast can fool us. Our logic is that such groups and extremism can only form when conditions become so unfair and brutal that this is an inevitable result and therefore the “oppressors” are ultimately to blame ( not the terrorist actors). That is only half true- for in our own country we see today extremist supremicist groups acting out in scenarios like the January 6 insurrection. Was it true that Dems stole the election and that white culture is so persecuted that Oath Keepers and Proud Boys were justified? Of course not.
Palestinian civilians have suffered at the hands of both Israeli policy and Hamas - who have ensured that Gaza became a prison by using aid money to only attack Israel and force a wider conflict which they exploit. Then throw in that Hamas is sponsored and supported by foreign actors like Iran who have their own Stake in keeping the conflict going.
So while Israeli policy must improve for sure , that alone will not dismantle such a terrorist group and their stranglehold over Gaza.
Yes exactly. Concerning 9/11, I would like to know why Saudi Arabia was not called on for reparations for all the victims. Since the largest portion of that group were Saudis!
Bingo! If Gaza and issues surrounding her didn’t exist, I still believe Hamas would have attacked because the bottom line is they want all Jews dead. Good bye Michael Moore. I’m done subscribing.
Why would anyone subscribe to this idiot anyway?
the man is so obnoxious and despised he is a very ugly man inside and he loathes himself. agree ending the subscription The Lord will deal with him
Totally agree! So disappointing.
Taking sides at this point in the world's madness just illustrates the level of insanity now being reached. A massive shift to sensibility is imminent.
i sincerely hope so!!
Yes the Likud party (zionists) ARE trying to exterminate all nonzionists from Israel...don't try to defend an evil ideology with denialism.
Theodor Hertzl was a madman that used zionism to seize power among his herd. Likud is just riding that same evil mule.
I don't think you read this whole Letter From Michael. When we know more, we rant less and refrain from non relevant accusals.
And yet over 1500 Palestinian children lay dead, 47 entire Palestinian families taken off the register in Gaza. All dead from Israeli bombs supplied in part by the U.S.
Their deaths are on Netanyahu’s hands, and on Biden’s hands. Man’s inhumanity to Man. How terribly, awfully tragic all of this is.
And if this goes unchecked in Israel and Gaza, it opens the doors to happen unchecked everywhere. And THAT is terrifying!
Israel does not want to kill all Palestinians as you say. It means to evacuate them. Just a bit more to go and then success. Andrew Jackson evacuated the Cherokee nation, but that was another time. Rounding up Palestinians and marching them on a trail of tears wouldn't be tolerated as it was when the Cherokee were marched to Oklahoma. Now it apparently takes a war and a warning to the Palestinians to evacuate what little is left of Palestine or get blown up by warplanes, bombs and tanks. Same motives with updated means. Andy Jackson could have done the same except he didn't have warplanes or tanks.
I watched how the British/Aussies murdered the aboriginals by surprise attacking villages in pre dawn "attacks" and driving them off cliffs and decapitating civilians including women and paying soldiers bounties for doing it then calling the actions a war. This was within the last 150 yrs. How can anyone excuse this type of behaviour in 2023? The military contractors are taking their turn on the greed wheel of fortune. Big pharma did it with covid. Tech did it with crypto and now AI. Big oil is always hogging the greed wheel of fortune. Big banks/ finance are now trying to take the wheel back with interest hikes. The money pigs will be stopped. Mass shift is imminent.
except please leave innocent pigs out of this.
There is a name for Palestinians who didn’t evacuate in 1948, Israeli citizens. Until this week of terror, they happily lived and worked in Israel.
While I agree with the point that Hamas started this, and they do not represent all of the Palestinians in Gaza, Israel is carrying out collective punishment by stopping the flow of water, food, fuel and power to the Strip. It is also killing civilians and destroying homes. These are war crimes, under the Geneva Conventions.
The sheer scale of the assault, coupled with the fact that all 10 crossings in or out of Gaza are closed (9 controlled directly by Israel, the 10th held by Egypt has been damaged by bombing and remains under threat of further attack by Israel), means that the population of 2.3 million people is extremely vulnerable and fast running out of very basic necessities for life. This in a place where 47% of the population are children.
What Hamas did was, and still is, wrong. I don’t understand how this response from Israel is going to return any hostages alive, when they are as likely to be injured or killed in the bombing as their captors are. I also don’t understand how this collective punishment is supposed to deter Hamas (or Hezbollah) in future, as surely it is just traumatising more young people, leading to the next generation in the cycle of hate.
Zionists "started" this by killing palestinians and driving them from their property. Did you know that any palestinians can't sell their property to other palestinians?
Are you aware that if any palestinians commit ANY crime (a teen throwing a rock at an idf conscript) they go to the home, remove the occupants and bulldoze the buildings, cut down the olive groves and seize the property?
Denialism is the cousin of zionism.
good they are troublemaking evil doers belong in the dark underworld they rejected every peace deal liar you are
Who you calling, "they"?
Who you calling "liar"?
How would you know either?
Sheeple say,"bah,bah,bah"
How old are you?
I saw Prime Minister Berscoloni in Charlie Rose years ago. PMB said the Palestinians have been camping out for 3 generations- the interview was approximately 20 years ago. Saying Palestinians started it is like saying Africa Americans started it. No justice. No peace.
Nobody is taking into account the MUCH bigger picture of Islam - the book has clear ends in mind - that of removing any & all humans that do not follow it's demands & succumb to it's authority - these terrorists are followers of THAT Islam - they believe ALL non -Muslims are to be exterminated in the name of their God. No matter how much pandering & 'partnering' to allow for peace happens, that end result is what they are aiming for, and peace is not part of the equation at all. Hence even as ordinary, peaceful Muslims go about their little lives that hell-bent 'Godly' ambition is driving what the extremists do. So - never be surprised at what pops up next as their psychological status demands we never trust them since 'the book' tells them everything is 'ok' as long as it furthers the ultimate purpose ! It's dangerous stuff, and the West does not realize just how dangerous they are ! I'm not sure about there being an actual 'satan' persona, but it certainly looks like the concept has legs to me !
All religions and dogmatic beliefs state this type of monopolistic worthiness doctrine, which only purpose is to divide humanity and continue to play into the fear mongers plan.
Not true.
The basic message of all religions is do unto others as you would have them do unto you. The other big message is we all have the power of determining our own existence by avoiding falling into the brainwash trap of fear and negativity. The real source information energy is accessible and if humanity can break the brainwash cycle long enough to tap into their fractal connection they'd realize the purpose of existence. These messages were clear in the unedited versions of most recorded or scripted versions of man's origin. These facts were redacted by corrupt religious and political criminal elites who saw the need to control dominate and enslave humanity for individual personal egotistical gain.
Well, someone had to go there. Unfortunately, there are good hearted people in every group. Remember The Women's March, where Israeli Jewish women and Palestinian Muslim women marched together for peace.
But as you've pointed out, the leadership throughout Islam, never condemns extremism... So how is that not condoning it? Mohammed's message was intended during war times... not to be creating endless wars to have relevance. Yet the misinterpretations are worshipped by the leadership of Muslim extremists.
The Jews have often been the only allies to the Middle Eastern Christians, who are the richest in indigenous blood, the most persecuted and devoutly teach, "though shalt not kill"... Yet the West ignores their existence, even as they go extinct.
The world is not educated enough to pick sides in this thousands of year old conflict. Yet if one had to choose to wake up tomorrow a woman or girl in either Palestine or Israel...
The world is not educated enough is so true. I fear mankind as a species is not capable of the level of education you call for. It's at most an ideal to hope and strive for.
Religion Huh? The root of so much human conflict and suffering. I have to wonder if it's incompatible with peace on earth.
Moore needs to get his arse over to Gaza they will exterminate him readily He's a Christian infidel and they are coming for the what they refer to as The Sunday people He is blind to this for some reason
Michael shared more of the history that led to this hideously bloody conflict--click on links. The more we learn, we see the world as less black and white. Unless people learn what really happened in 1948, and then '67, and '73, and so on....
One example here, are you aware of Bibi's attempt to strengthen Hamas in order to weaken the Palestinian Authority? As a result, Hamas felt deeper distrust of Israel, and the PA lost more power to govern and help the Palestinian people. All of this was for Bibi to strengthen his position. Did you follow the links on those who were complicit in Rabin's assassination? (now in power). No one is excusing Hamas, or suggesting equivalency of Hamas and Israel.
His implication that Palestinians never hurt any Jews is ludicrous, too. He must have forgotten that Hamas is Palestinian--and the Palestinians elected Hamas.
What?
Definition and explanation of Hamastine:
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3513/hamas-palestine-un
Michael, I am about to say something I do not want to say. The truth is that I agree with the intention that no further innocents should die. II am an American non-Jew who lived in Israel for almost 3 years after the Six-Day War. I love Israel, like it is a part of me-- much as I love the United States. I am also a long-time student of Sufism (for those who are unfamiliar with the term, it is-- very roughly speaking-- the mystical side of Islam). What you say about the Palestinians not having been responsible for Auschwitz is true. But neither were the Russians who instigated pogroms against the Jews responsible for Auschwitz; neither were the French whose Vichy regime allied with the Nazis. Neither were the Spanish who evicted the Jews from Spain along with the Muslims. Neither were American white supremacists responsible for Auschwitz, though there is now evidence that the Germans learned from jim crow. The list is long and longer than this of peoples who were not responsible for Auschwitz, yet persecuted the Jews because they were Jews. In addition to this, there is the Hamas Charter. Though it has been amended to suggest a softening of opposition to Israel, here is an excerpt from Wikipedia:
"The original Charter identified Hamas as the Muslim Brotherhood in Palestine and declares its members to be Muslims who "fear God and raise the banner of Jihad in the face of the oppressors." The charter states that "our struggle against the Jews is very great and very serious" and calls for the eventual creation of an Islamic state in Palestine, in place of Israel and the Palestinian Territories,[3] and the obliteration or dissolution of Israel.[4][5] It emphasizes the importance of jihad, stating in article 13, "There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."[6] The charter also states that Hamas is humanistic, and tolerant of other religions as long as they "stop disputing the sovereignty of Islam in this region".[7] The Charter adds that "renouncing any part of Palestine means renouncing part of the religion [of Islam]".[1]
This is what the Palestinians who founded Hamas sought. We in the West tend to soften the harshness of these goals too, asserting that what Palestinians “really want” is “self-determination” a vague notion that manages to finesse their real goal of liberation. It is true that most Palestinians want only to live in peace. That’s also true of most Israelis-- most people everwhere want to live in peace. But as it is sometimes remarked that Israelis just wish the Palestinians would disappear as a problem, the same is true for the Palestinians. Even those not committed to violence like to think of a day when Israel is no more, disappeared back into the mists of time. Israelis would experience relief if the Palestinians were no longer there and Palestinians would feel the same way if Israel were no longer there.
So, what is my point? That so long as the Israelis and the Palestinians regard one another’s existence as a threat to their own, nothing will change. That peace-- real peace-- requires some real willingness to give up the quest for one’s own survival at all costs. That real peace requires a willingness to acknowledge each other’s suffering and say, in effect, “We do not want you to suffer any more and we will stand by you as brothers. We want you to have a state and independence and we want to be your brother state: we will defend you and you will defend us. There will no longer be one justice for me and a different justice for you.”
And the problem is that neither is willing to do this, trust the other. Because each side knows the other just wants it to disappear. To do this would require a deep spiritual revival among both Israelis and Palestinians, Jews and Muslims. In their respective spiritual traditions and teachings there is common ground and spiritual brotherhood to be found for those willing to seek these. But we are not in times that people feel inspired to seek spiritual guidance. Unless those who suffer are willing to seek spiritual ground with those they deem responsible for their suffering and the suffering of their loved ones, the best that one who loves both sides who live in this “holy land” can do, is advocate for Justice to be implented even against one’s self and one’s family. That justice is also called Compassion. I am 75 years old now and have become convinced that in this life in this world, the only possible way to receive it is to first be willing to extend it. I pray to God that He soften hearts enough that they be willing to risk themselves for this possibility.